resin vs rosin (esp on 3r, 4v) - change translation?

[njr2128]

From THU as part of varnishes in the rain research: The A-P uses rousine and resine on 3r, but we don't translate consistently. Even so, I think the "resin" for rousine in the definition of colophony that he gives in the upper-left margin should be changed to "rosin." I imagine the "recooking" is what occasioned the "resin" choice, but I disagree. On 4v, he identifies rosin (rousine) as the residue left behind after producing oil of turpentine.

[ps2270]

I checked Marjolijn's essay and THU is right: rosin is used for the residue left behind after producing oil of turpentine. Marjolijn writes that colophony is also sometimes called rosin. So, rousine should be translated as rosin.

[njr2128]

Next steps: NJR or THC to pull every instance of "rousine" and then decide with PHS what translation should be for each case

[njr2128]

• All instances of rousi across the xml files is here: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1PEGCdD9yIB2Fq180ZcLrnIOtJv8awgNgapcMmcsJbLc/edit#gid=519606536 (54 instances which includes tc and tcn and tl)
• all instances of rosi in tl is here: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1WhSAcimOFfguhTXBfHXdsczIy1jvXeS5boDeFMpxEb0/edit#gid=519606536 (26 instances)
• all instances of resi in tl is here: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1nAynwXSfin_jtaS5yjKB9iFb-qj9-42Z1ltoIhKWhXA/edit#gid=519606536 (35 instances)

[ps2270]

Marjolijn's footnote on resine vs. rousine (maybe this should be added to glossary?): It is not entirely clear what type of resin *rousine* (also sometimes called *resine* in the same context) refers to in this manuscript, but it is referred to in many recipes. A note on fol. 3r <https://edition640.makingandknowing.org/#/folios/3r> explains that *la colophonie* is nothing other than *rousine* “cooked again” (*recuite*) to make it liquid and to purify it. It is also uncertain what kind of resin is purified in this process, but the fact that that the resin is “reboiled” could mean that it refers to the hard residue left after distilling a turpentine oleoresin, which Ms. Fr. 640 explains on fol. 3v <https://edition640.makingandknowing.org/#/folios/3v/f/3v/tc> is known as *la colophoine* or *pix græca.* *Here is the glossary entry now for both resine and rousine: **Resine*, rousine (mod. résine), n.(f): resin, see also →colophoine

…

On Fri, May 3, 2024 at 3:53 PM Naomi Rosenkranz ***@***.***> wrote: - All instances of rousi across the xml files is here: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1PEGCdD9yIB2Fq180ZcLrnIOtJv8awgNgapcMmcsJbLc/edit#gid=519606536 (54 instances which includes tc and tcn and tl) - all instances of rosi in tl is here: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1WhSAcimOFfguhTXBfHXdsczIy1jvXeS5boDeFMpxEb0/edit#gid=519606536 (26 instances) - all instances of resi in tl is here: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1nAynwXSfin_jtaS5yjKB9iFb-qj9-42Z1ltoIhKWhXA/edit#gid=519606536 (35 instances) — Reply to this email directly, view it on GitHub <#2087 (comment)>, or unsubscribe <https://github.com/notifications/unsubscribe-auth/AF75UYAZICQK53UHI75WBX3ZAPTK3AVCNFSM6AAAAAA4T2VN6CVHI2DSMVQWIX3LMV43OSLTON2WKQ3PNVWWK3TUHMZDAOJTGY3TEMJYGE> . You are receiving this because you were assigned.Message ID: ***@***.***>

[ps2270]

So, what is "rosin"? I'm sure we've had full discussions about this previously, but here is "rosin" from OED "from 1393– A kind of resin (see resin *n.* A.1a <https://www.oed.com/dictionary/resin_n?tab=meaning_and_use#25635335>); (*in later use)* spec. a solid form obtained as a residue after the distillation of oil of turpentine from crude turpentine. The colour of the product (yellow, brown, or black) depends on the length of time that heat is applied during distillation. Rosin is used in the manufacture of paints, varnishes, adhesives, soldering fluxes, size for paper, etc. It is rubbed on the bow hair of violins and similar stringed instruments, and applied in powdered form to shoes, gloves, etc., by dancers and sports competitors to prevent slipping." OED's examples from 1393 on do not illuminate much. OED "resin" also confusing. I'm beginning to think that the a-p didn't necessarily distinguish between liquid resin and solid rosin, or did so inconsistently. In modern parlance, "*rousine pulverisee" *or "a piece" of rousine would indicate the solid form that we call "rosin" in English today and I think that's how we made the distinction before. (I feel like I'm repeating one of the discussions we had over and over in the past!) Maybe we should have left *rousine *and *resine *in the original French. Or maybe in those very unclear sections, we should revert to it?

…

On Sat, May 4, 2024 at 7:00 AM Pamela H. Smith ***@***.***> wrote: Marjolijn's footnote on resine vs. rousine (maybe this should be added to glossary?): It is not entirely clear what type of resin *rousine* (also sometimes called *resine* in the same context) refers to in this manuscript, but it is referred to in many recipes. A note on fol. 3r <https://edition640.makingandknowing.org/#/folios/3r> explains that *la colophonie* is nothing other than *rousine* “cooked again” (*recuite*) to make it liquid and to purify it. It is also uncertain what kind of resin is purified in this process, but the fact that that the resin is “reboiled” could mean that it refers to the hard residue left after distilling a turpentine oleoresin, which Ms. Fr. 640 explains on fol. 3v <https://edition640.makingandknowing.org/#/folios/3v/f/3v/tc> is known as *la colophoine* or *pix græca.* *Here is the glossary entry now for both resine and rousine: **Resine*, rousine (mod. résine), n.(f): resin, see also →colophoine On Fri, May 3, 2024 at 3:53 PM Naomi Rosenkranz ***@***.***> wrote: > > - All instances of rousi across the xml files is here: > https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1PEGCdD9yIB2Fq180ZcLrnIOtJv8awgNgapcMmcsJbLc/edit#gid=519606536 > (54 instances which includes tc and tcn and tl) > - all instances of rosi in tl is here: > https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1WhSAcimOFfguhTXBfHXdsczIy1jvXeS5boDeFMpxEb0/edit#gid=519606536 > (26 instances) > - all instances of resi in tl is here: > https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1nAynwXSfin_jtaS5yjKB9iFb-qj9-42Z1ltoIhKWhXA/edit#gid=519606536 > (35 instances) > > — > Reply to this email directly, view it on GitHub > <#2087 (comment)>, > or unsubscribe > <https://github.com/notifications/unsubscribe-auth/AF75UYAZICQK53UHI75WBX3ZAPTK3AVCNFSM6AAAAAA4T2VN6CVHI2DSMVQWIX3LMV43OSLTON2WKQ3PNVWWK3TUHMZDAOJTGY3TEMJYGE> > . > You are receiving this because you were assigned.Message ID: > ***@***.***> >

[ps2270]

Previous discussion (why didn't I look for this before?):
#571
If we assume that resin/pitch is liquid, and rosin is the solid form of this resin, created by heating resin to drive off the volatile liquid components, then we should search for "resine," "rousine," and decide whether they should be translated as resin or rosin. On 98r, "rousine" should definitely be translated "rosin" instead of "resin" (I have learned from Celine's annotation). On 3r, both rousine and resine are used, and in at least one case, we have translated rousine as resin when it actually should be rosin.

[ps2270]

Only on 3r, we will change in the upper left marginal comment our translation of rousine to rosin.
Also need to change essays that cite our translation of this marginal note:
Marjolijn
Distillation in Ms. Fr. 640
Varnishes in the rain
and others?

[njr2128]

glossary also updated as it did not contain a separate entry for "rousine" and colophony had the misspelled variant (colophoine) as the headword

[ps2270]

Need to change essays that quote this passage.