easybox parcel locker: split HU & RO, fix operators, add tags

[gy-mate]

This PR fixes easybox parcel locker data.

• Split HU & RO variants
• Fix operators (Sameday is just a brand, not the actual operator)
• Add tags to HU variant

[UKChris-osm]

Thanks @gy-mate

We generally don't include contact: or payment: tagging within the NSI however.

[gy-mate]

@UKChris-osm Thank you for the quick reaction!

We generally don't include contact: or payment: tagging within the NSI however.

I've removed them and added this info to the wiki.

[Dimitar5555]

I don't think that OSM likes having company types (EAD, Zrt, or S.A.) in operator fields (it may depend on the local community though). Also why does the Hungarian entry have operator:addr and company numbers tags? Is it common to place such tags there?

[gy-mate]

I don't think that OSM likes having company types (EAD, Zrt, or S.A.) in operator fields (it may depend on the local community though).

@Dimitar5555 The local community agrees on this, I've just asked them about it (1, 2). ref:HU:company=* and ref:HU:vatin=* is also tied to the company name and type.

Also why does the Hungarian entry have operator:addr and company numbers tags? Is it common to place such tags there?

Yes, it is. See operator:addr=*, ref:HU:company=* and ref:HU:vatin=* on Overpass Turbo.

[UKChris-osm]

I'd probably remove the operator:addr and ref tags as well from this index, as while it may seem handy having all these tags automatically added from within the NSI, I feel like it's out of scope for what we're trying to maintain, which is only really a canonical index of name / brand / operator.

It can also cause problems later on if an address or reference changes. If that information is available within the Wikidata article for each entry, then updating it there would make it available to those who need it.

[Snowysauce]

Apart from the discussion about payment:*, I agree with everything that's been said by the other maintainers. The operator:addr and ref:* tags are a maintenance nightmare waiting to happen, and they should be excluded from the NSI for the same reasons why we don't include contact:* tags.

In the case of payment:*, those tags have historically been allowed on a limited, case-by-case basis.

[UKChris-osm]

I hadn't realised payment: tagging was allowed in certain circumstances.

Personally I feel like that's an extra layer of maintenance we shouldn't be burdening ourselves with.

[bhousel]

Oh yeah, my thought on this is that payment tags probably make sense for some limited kinds of POIs, like vending machines, or transit ticket machines, and it's probably fine for the parcel lockers too, and probably some other things I am not thinking about.

I mostly want to avoid something like people adding payment:cash=yes to every fast food brand world wide. While technically correct, it doesn't help anyone and would just be annoying and generate millions of tag upgrade warnings. There are a lot of tags on https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:payment like this.

[UKChris-osm]

Oh yeah, my thought on this is that payment tags probably make sense for some limited kinds of POIs, like vending machines, or transit ticket machines, and it's probably fine for the parcel lockers too, and probably some other things I am not thinking about.

That makes sense regarding vending and ticket machines. I didn't actually think parcel lockers took payments directly though, I thought it was all done online or via an app?

[gy-mate]

I'd probably remove the operator:addr and ref tags as well from this index

@UKChris-osm @Snowysauce No problem, I've removed them! The wiki has been updated as well.

[gy-mate]

I didn't actually think parcel lockers took payments directly though, I thought it was all done online or via an app?

@UKChris-osm That's the case at Z-Boxes:

But most other types of parcel lockers in Hungary do have a POS terminal:

[DnaX]

At least in Romania, Sameday it's the brand/name used by S.C. DELIVERY SOLUTIONS S.A..

Unfortunately it's very common to have a registered company with pointless name but nice marketing brand. Sameday it's the operator because Sameday it's how "S.C. DELIVERY SOLUTIONS S.A." it's known.

[UKChris-osm]

I'd suggest removing the operator tagging altogether and keeping it simple with just the brand tagging, as this is a part of the brand tree. While it might seem to make sense including operator, my view is "what if the operator changes, or the brand is sold, what if the brand expands via another operator in another country", etc.

[Snowysauce]

I agree with @UKChris-osm; given all the discussion above, I'd recommend:

• dropping all of the operator tags from the preset
• making a Wikidata item for the operator (if one doesn't exist) and placing all the name variations (and address) there
• linking that page to the brand Wikidata page and vice versa (via the "operator"/"item operated" properties)

This way, the info in all its various forms is available from OSM to whoever wants it (via brand:wikidata and the links on its Wikidata page) without leading to prolonged discussions on OSM or here.

[DnaX]

When i first created the preset, I added Sameday as operator just because some of those parcel lockers where sponsored by eMAG e-shop, so lots of people tagged as eMAG owned parcels (like Amazon Hubs).

BTW... ok to remove the operator tags.

[sammyhawkrad]

"what if the operator changes, or the brand is sold, what if the brand expands via another operator in another country", etc.

Then the entries are updated here. Does this not happen sometimes?

[gy-mate]

In the case of payment:*, those tags have historically been allowed on a limited, case-by-case basis.

payment tags probably make sense for some limited kinds of POIs, like vending machines, or transit ticket machines, and it's probably fine for the parcel lockers too

I've put payment:*=* tags back in the list.

[gy-mate]

I'd recommend:

• dropping all of the operator tags from the preset

@UKChris-osm @Snowysauce @DnaX Done...

• making a Wikidata item for the operator (if one doesn't exist) and placing all the name variations (and address) there

...done:

• Delivery Solutions Zrt. (Q131107197)
• S.C. Delivery Solutions S.A. (Q114417096)
• Delivery Solutions EOOD. (Q131107345)

• linking that page to the brand Wikidata page and vice versa (via the "operator"/"item operated" properties)

...and done (I hope I've edited them correctly):

• easybox (Q114496224)
• Sameday (Q131107307)

[gy-mate]

Then the entries are updated here. Does this not happen sometimes?

@sammyhawkrad I also support the idea of not duplicating things in order to make them easier to maintain.

[UKChris-osm]

As this has now become quite a long thread, can I just confirm the aim of this PR:

Currently, easybox is listed twice in the NSI, one for Bulgaria and one for Romania & Hungary, with both using the same Wikidata number.

The PR splits Romania & Hungary into a separate entry, so the NSI has 3 entries, all using the same Wikidata?

[CrowOk9830]

Fix operators (Sameday is just a brand, not the actual operator)

Sameday is a well known international courier service. Iit's a company group as stated on the about us page of their website.

In a survey, mappers will see Sameday on the parcel locker (the blue sticker shown previously is an older version; refer to pictures on the main page of their website or on their delivery vehicles), which clearly assigns some importance to that word. We should map what's on the ground mainly. (If Sameday is not the operator, what is that, how it should be tagged, or is it unimportant?)

On the other hand, the country-specific subsidiary company is not presented on the machine (except on the receipt maybe, if printed at all) and not a well known operator name. Thus changing operator to that feels some opinionated nitpicking, and ambiguity can lead to many edit wars.

The OSM wiki for Tag:amenity=parcel_locker also encourages using only the main operator name, such as operator=DPD, operator=DHL, operator=Amazon etc., not the local subsidiary with company type appended. Perhaps it`s worth discussing operator tagging practice more widely and doing changes in sync with OSM wiki.

From the point of view of NSI I can agree to keep operator=Sameday or remove it but not to change.

(Also note that Packate's Z-BOX is a similar case, where the brand of the parcel locker is Z-BOX, the operator is the Packeta courier service company group. I'm note sure brand=Packeta and name=Z-BOX is ok in terms of naming, because it applies the same name to every Packeta operated parcel locker (compared to the AlzaBox). Also see the OSM wiki about parcel locker names.)