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Article hadopi sopa #3
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layout: post | ||
title: "SOPA, Hadopi and the future of culture" | ||
date: 2012-03-29 08:24 | ||
comments: true | ||
categories: [sopa, hadopi, copyright, music, movies, culture] | ||
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The copyright industry is busy trying to force the US to adopt the SOPA | ||
law while its French counterpart, Hadopi, is already up and | ||
There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. c'est vraiment pas les memes lois, tu peux difficilement les comparer There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. La SOPA est carrement a l'ordre du jour, ils l'ont bashe une fois mais ils vont revenir a la charge Hadopi et SOPA c'est pas exactement pareil mais c'est tout de meme tres proche dans l'idee. La c'est pas une analyse technique des lois mais plus l'analyse de la tendance a vouloir controler intenret There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. oui mais dans ce cas la tu ne peux pas dire counterpart. Hadopi ne met pas du tout en danger des sites a contenu genere par des utiilisateurs. Il faut reformuler There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. Certes, mais je ne pense que ca parle tout de meme. The Economist pare tjrs de Hadopi comme d'une "light SOPA". There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. bah ca m'arrangereait que tu fasses comme the economist alors :P |
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running. This brings two questions: | ||
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* What will be the future model for accessing culture ? Will today's | ||
There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. pas d'espace avant les ? (pareil pour les :,!, dans tout l'article) There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. OK je change |
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giants be part of it ? | ||
* How can we ensure that laws are made by people with sufficient | ||
knowledge of the field they try to regulate ? | ||
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I will cover the first question in this post and the second one in a few | ||
days. | ||
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[](http://www.flickr.com/photos/27539822@N05/3697785107/) | ||
*by [Christian Holmer](http://www.christianholmer.com/ "Author")* | ||
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## Dying industries in this new era | ||
Since the beginning of the "Internet at home" era, the music and movie | ||
industries have been fighting tooth and nail against filesharing. | ||
There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. non t'y vas beaucoup trop fort, ce n'et pas toute la music and movies industries qui font ca. Ce sont les recording industries. There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. bien sur que tout n'est pas moisi, mais je ne parle que des majors. Je pourrais remplacer industries par majors d'ailleurs There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. oui c'est mieux |
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Deeming filesharers "pirates", they spent the last decade suing a lot of | ||
P2P users, protecting CDs and DVDs with DRMs and lobbying for a strict control of | ||
the Internet. | ||
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Basically, their line is "if you don't want what we | ||
offer, when we offer it and at the price we're offering it, you always have | ||
the option of not getting it". They may be right, but they're not [pragmatic](http://www.marco.org/2012/02/25/right-vs-pragmatic "pragmatic"). Consumers don't like to pay for CDs that are DRM-locked, or for a zone 1 DVD that only works in 2 countries and begins with a 10 minutes ["illegal downloading is ripping out a beating human heart" ad](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OWPfcEOr2Yg "Bender piracy warning"). In fact, consumers don't even want to drive to the nearest Virgin Megastore to get the latest season of Game of Thrones. | ||
There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. not being pragmatic |
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That's why these industries will die eventually: they try to stick to | ||
There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. t'y vas un peu fort la. quelles industries? (pourquoi au pluriel) et qui produira le contenu si elles meurent? on pourrait croire que tu annonces la mort de la musique et des films There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. Hollywood et les grands labels traditionnels (Sony, Universal par exemple). Qui produira le contenu si elles meurent ? Des labels independants (moins vrai dans le cas d'Hollywood que pour la musique mais j'ai pas envie de rentrer trop dans les details). En fait, comme je l'ecris plus bas, elles vendent des bouts de plastique, et on n'a pas besoin de plastique a l'ere des objets connectes (un film bientot ca se telechargera, le DVD va mourir). There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. ouai enfin elles produisent le contenu aussi avant de vendre des bouts de plastique. There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. Oui, c'est pour ca que je vais explicitement separer ces activites. C'est bien sur la distribution en magasin qui va s'ecrouler, et celle sur internet qui est en compet avec le P2P |
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their old business model of selling *products* (CDs, DVDs, MP3 files) ladden with commercials while the public only | ||
There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. laden |
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wants access to *culture* (songs, movies, series, books). And the Internet has proven | ||
to be pretty good at providing exactly this, for free. | ||
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## People still want to pay for what they love | ||
Does that mean that artists are doomed to become destitue as consumers | ||
There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. to be left destitute, as consumers get their work for free POINT. There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. certes mieux There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. sauf un truc : tu veux couper la suite apres "for free" ? There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. oui, je couperais en 2 phrases |
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will get their work for free, as the story championed by these | ||
industries go ? Of course not ! People want to pay for what they love. | ||
For example, you can look at [Flattr](http://flattr.com/ Flattr). Or you | ||
can consider the fact that [Radiohead made between $6M and $10M from a | ||
"pay-what-you-want" album](http://www.wired.com/listening_post/2007/10/estimates-radio/ "Radiohead"). | ||
There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. sans le comparer a ce qu'ils avaient gagne en passant par la voie classique et sans donner le nombre d'albums vendus ca n'a que peu de poids. honnetement je trouve pas ca beaucoup pour un groupe aussi connu. There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. Si c'est enorme justement, puisque les gens pouvaient donner 0. Ca veut dire que les gens sont prets a payer si on ne les prend pas pour des glands. There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. bah non tu peux pas comparer en absolu mec c'est pas possible. si ca se trouve ils auraient gagne 100millions avec la voie classique. There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. oui, mais je pense que Internet va amener une diminution de la valeur totale de cette industrie, un peu comme l'arrivee de free detruit 10000 emplois chez les autres. Je ne rentre pas dans les details car je trouve que c'est trop vaste comme sujet. There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. c a c'est un point tres interessant. je trouve vraiment que tu devrais te focaliser sur quelques points e nprofondeur plutot qu'une vue super high level de tout qui n'apporte pas grand chose |
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But as I said, *what we love is culture, not products*. We don't to pay | ||
There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. ??? wtf There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. ??? again, qu'est ce que tu veux dire ? There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. depuis quand on n'aime pas les produits? |
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for pieces of plastic anymore. Now that we have a mean to access content | ||
for almost nothing, we don't see why intermediaries such as Sony and | ||
There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. means |
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Universal should get the lion's share of the profits instead of the | ||
artists and the recording studios. In fact they should not even exist. | ||
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There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. wtf? sony and universal are the recording studios. should not even exist? really? There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. Ah non justement. Je pense qu'il faut que je separe :
There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. il faut bien que quelqu'un fasse la distribution non? meme si le modele de distribution doit changer |
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## How artists can get paid | ||
I believe that *the best model for giving access to culture to consumers | ||
is that of a global license*, where you pay a fixed amount every month | ||
There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. honnetement le "I believe that the best" est moyen venant de quelqu'un comme nous. On n'y connait pas grand chose a la distribution du contenu. J'aime pas du tout cette phrase There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. Bah justement je donne mon point de vue. Je pretends pas avoir deja distribue du contenu mais j'ai un point de vue de consommateur. There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. ouai mais c'est la que le bat blesse, c'est vraiment pas credible. Tu devrais rester du point de vue du consommateur et analyser en quoi le modele actuel est pourri et ne correspond pas aux attentes et aux habitudes des gens, mais de ka a recommander un modele c'est too much |
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(say, $30) and you can download anything. The exchanges would be | ||
There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. ca s'appelle un subscription model There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. J'ai vu global license utilise aussi, t'es sur de toi ? There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. de toute facon je pense vraiment que cette partie est a reecrire. Si tu veux parle du modele spotify et dit qu'il faudrait le generaliser. Parle aussi de tv-links.eu en disant que c'est ce genre d'interface que devraient fournir les majors et qu'on pourrait tres bien imaginer un modele a la spotify. Mais la c'est pas credible |
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monitored so that the most downloaded artists receive more money than | ||
the others. The redistribution system could also be tweaked in favor of | ||
smaller, unknown artists to support discovery. | ||
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There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. t'es conscient que tu viens de te contredire? There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. c'est a dire ? There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. bah donner le + de thunes aux plus downloaded et en meme temps recompenser les inconnus. comment tu concilies ca? |
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The above only concerns the content consumption at home, which has to be | ||
cheap since high prices cannot compete with free alternatives. But *there | ||
are alternative revenue streams for artists and the culture industry that cannot be copied or downloaded*. You cannot download a concert | ||
experience, watching a movie in a theatre is a much more enjoyable than at home, you cannot print you own Metallica posters, and | ||
so on. There is a huge amount of money here, more than enough to ensure | ||
There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. is much more enjoyable, mais au-dela de cette typo je ne suis pas d'accord et c'est encore pire aux US ou tout le monde est en train de textoter et bouffer du popcorn There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. Again, c'est mon point de vue, je pense pas qu'on puisse remplacer le cine, et j'adore y aller, meme avec les pubs et les gamins de 15 ans qui hurlent. There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. ok dans ce cas la soit plus precis, parce qu'on a l'impression que tu parles en general |
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sustainable culture creation. In fact, *I think that mp3s and divxs | ||
There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. chiffres? There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. je suis pas sur qu'on aie besoin de chiffres si ? par ce que j'ai pas envie de passer du temps a chercher des chiffres la ... Et c'est clair que ;e cine est largement rentable. Quant aux concerts, ca me vient de potes musicos There was a problem hiding this comment. Choose a reason for hiding this commentThe reason will be displayed to describe this comment to others. Learn more. bah franchement si. tu peux pas balancer des affirmations comme ca sans les appuyer sur des chiffres. c'est donner le baton pour se faire battre au cas ou ce soit faux, et c'est vraiment choquant. Moi quand je lis ca je me dis (preuve?) |
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should be seen as marketing for these experiences*, which is why they | ||
should be so cheap. | ||
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So I'm not worried about artists, we will find a way to give them our | ||
money, and encourage content creation. But the current model will soon | ||
be dead, and [we should hasten its demise](http://ycombinator.com/rfs9.html "we should hasten its demise"). | ||
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il me semble que la SOPA a ete annulee? ils l'ont remise a l'ordre du jour ?